UP FRONT WITH FOGESFIGHTING WORDSJAMES COURTNEY DOESN'T PULL ANY PUNCHES AS HE BARES HIS SOUL TO MARK FOGARTY ABOUT HIS HRT HORROR, AND WHY JAMIE WHINCUP BETTER BE WATCHING HIS MIRRORS IN 2012AA's EDITOR-AT-LARGE MARK FOGARTY TALKS TO THE NEWS MAKERSTHIS TIME a year ago, he was on top of the VB world. He was the underdog who'd beaten the all-powerful Jamie Whincup/ Triple Eight, in a team racked with internal turmoil.Somewhat surprisingly - and in some quarters, very controversially - he'd turned his back not only on DJR, but also Ford. He defected to HAT amid claims that he had left FPR in the lurch. But it was a big money move to an iconic operation, so what could go wrong? Pretty much everything. Courtney joined HAT at the peak of its growing crisis, condemning his #1 plate to ignominy as he struggled with a recalcitrant car and team unrest. Few drivers of such talent and charisma suffer such a steep fall from grace so quickly.His thrilling door-to-door battle with Jason Bright in just the second race of the season at Abu Dhabi flattered to deceive. Courtney's championship-winning form wasn't seen again until Sandown, bested only by Rick Kelly in the treacherous conditions. As HAT reorganised and regrouped on the run, Courtney hauled himself up to 10th in the championship - still the worst title defence in ATCCNB history -and was vilified by his fellow drivers and the fans in AA's annual poll.Never one to shy away from his critics, he speaks candidly about his horror year, and why it hadn't left him dispirited ...Let's not beat around the bush. Just how bad a year was it for you?Oh, there were 18 guys that had a worse year than I did. I finished 10th. But it wasn't a year I was happy with.I didn't achieve what we wanted to, not only myself but as a team. But like I said, a bad year for me or a year that I'm really unhappy with is a good year for quite a few people. I'm my toughest critic, and being in the limelight as the defending champion, you do get critiqued harder than the rest.Well, that's the point, isn't it? You can put the spin on -that you did better than 18 other blokes did, but it's not what's expected of the reigning champion, is it? No, that's exactly right, and if I was happy with it, I'm in the wrong business. I'm only happy when I'm winning.So how bad did it get for you?Oh, it never got to the point where I thought 'this is it, I'm packing ii all in.' It was far from that. Coming into ii, to be honest, I knew it was going to be a challenge, but it was probably harder than what I first anticipated. There were quite a few things that went on in the team that I don't have to bring up again -everyone knows -and that probably made the year more challenging than what it had to be and probably hindered us a little throughout the year. But in the end, I never questioned the move that I made. I'd still make it if I were in the same position now as I was this time last year. If I knew what was going to happen, I'd still do the same thing.Really? You don't regret the move? You could hardly have done worse, resultwise.I think there could have been a lot worse situations, but, no, I'd definitely make the same decision again.I'm not being flippant. Really, if you'd stayed at DJR, your results wouldn't have been much different.If I'd stayed al DJR, I would have been struggling to come last. The team that it was when we won the championship isn't the same team it is now. One, different team manager. Two, all the mechanics left apart from a couple of the boys. The whole engineering staff has changed. It's definitely not the same place.No, but you said you'd struggle to come last and to be fair, DJR hasn't been that bad.Ah, I didn't see them around the front towards the end of the year.So you were going to leave DJR whatever happened?If it had all stayed the same; if Adrian (Burgess) and all the boys, all the' engineers, were still there; if they were happy campers and had a (similar) budget, then, yes, I would have still been there.But that was never going to happen.No. Everyone knew that was never going to happen.Going back to what I asked you earlier -how bad did it get -I meant how frustrating was the year? When was the most difficult part of the season, and why?There was a period there when we did a steering arm nearly every weekend for like the first seven weekends or something crazy and that was incredibly frustrating, because it took a long time for it to get sorted. There were so many things going on that when we got to Darwin, I don't want to speak for Garth, but for me, as a team I think that was the lowest point. That's when I was the most frustrated.That was rock-bottom for the team, wasn't it?The car wasn't working the way we wanted it and they'd had a number of failures and, yeah, that wasn't the best race weekend I've had.Although that was the beginning of the turnaround, wasn't it?Yes. And that was the hard thing. Garth and I kept saying "Look, we're making improvements", but the results weren't showing it. I think guys who've been around the business a long time - I'm not blowing wind up your arse, Foges, but guys like yourself - know it's not a switch. It doesn't just happen - it's something you have to work at - and that's where a lot of processes starting going into place and where we started to evolve and change from there.And really from that decision made by the Walkinshaw group (change of team management) just before then was something we started to see the benefit of towards the end of the year.By Homebush, were the progress and the prospect of more progress next year more tangible?Very much so. I think we made a huge improvement, especially over the last four events - from Bathurst, really. That's when we started to make good ground on the car, we had good race pace, we weren't having failures and things were starting to come together. I would've had a lot better results, but we got done with stacking, as quite a few guys did, but, definitely, from the endures we really started to make some headway.JAMES COURTNEYYou said earlier that you went to HRT with your eyes wide open, but it was actually in worse shape than you thought. How did you deal with that?Look, I knew it was going to be a challenge the whole way, but I also knew that with the brainpower there, the resources, the backing, it has to succeed. There's no choice there.It has to succeed - and it will, no matter what - and that's something that attracted me to the place. It has the resources and the ability for that change to happen. It is a proper business - it's not a family-run sort of operation - so they need results and they'll do what they have to do to get them. The amount of development we did in that short period was pretty phenomenal. We were running around in the 20s at Darwin and Queensland Raceway, and at the last two events of the year both Garth and I got seconds (in the Saturday races) and we were running at the front. So we've made quite a big improvement.When the big management shake-up occurred, did you see that as a good sign, or were you nervous?I wouldn't say I was nervous at all. I felt it was the right decision was made (to appoint Mike Henry as de facto team manager and new managing director in Steve Hallam).I think time has proved it was the right thing to do. So I wasn't at all nervous. The calibre of person they picked in Steve Hallam to steer the ship was very encouraging. Sure, it would've been fantastic to be able to get him on board straight away (he started this week) and Mike's done a great job guiding the team through this period, and he's been a big part of getting us to where we are. So I don't think at any point I would've said I was nervous about the decisions.JAMES COURTNEYIt seemed that through the year you struggled to adapt the car to your driving style because even through the difficulties, Garth was still dragging the odd result out of the car. But until the end of the season, it never seemed that you were quite comfortable with the HAT car.I think the biggest thing was that Garth's a strong personality, which I see as a good thing, but it's been Garth steering the ship in recent years, so the cars have very much evolved and developed for one driving style for one person.So that's why that had happened and, like you said, Garth has pulled some results out of it. He's won two more races than I did, and I think that's down to the fact that the car has been developed to suit him. He's been in the team since 2007 and the car was designed around him. It's been great working with him. I think at the start of the year, we didn't bang heads or argue, but we weren't really 100 per cent into each other. I trusted him, but I think at first he thought I was a moron or something, but as it went on, he started to value my opinion and I think that's what made the development process a lot quicker as well.He did realise that I knew what I was talking about and that we could get it going pretty well with some of the ideas that we (Courtney and his engineer Scott Sinclair, who came with him from DJR), and I think that's brought on a lot of the pace towards the end of the year. See, the car can be quick the way it was, but it was so hit-and-miss. It could be quick one lap and then the track temperature changes by three degrees and the thing's all over the place. So the problem was that the window of operation was too small. The way you drove the car was very fiddly and unpredictable, and that's why it was so inconsistent. Over the year, we haven't really brought so much more pace into the car as opposed to predictability and that's something that I'm big on and wanting from the car. That's what it didn't have, so that's why I struggled. As the year went on and I was able to have my own input into the car and then Garth started to like some of the things that I brought in, the evolution process pulled another three gears and we took off and started to get some really good results. I think a lot of it was him knowing exactly what the car was, because he's worked with it for years, and then once we changed it to a little more how I like it - which we are still evolving; we'll never stop - that helped me towards the end the year, and also brought him a lot better results as well. So it's been a benefit for both of us.What's the difference between how you and Garth drive the cars?Garth drives it ridiculously deep - like, crazy-arse deep - into the corner. He just nails the brakes, pulls it up. He doesn't turn at all while he's braking, so it's just brrraaawww, straight-brake, then gets off the brake and turns the thing really, really hard and sort of just vees off the corner, and then stabs the throttle. Coming from what I've done before - the karting in Europe, the formula cars and the sportscars - it's all about flow and momentum, so what I was wanting to try to do was load the car on the entry to the corner and carry the speed through the corner. But we just had no stability through the platform for me to do that because it's something they never needed from the car before because of the way Garth drove the car.So that was the two big differences in what we needed from the car, and now after working with Garth for the past year, I think he's probably realised that there's some benefits with the way that I drive the car, and there's benefits the way he drives it. So we've both evolved.I'm not stupid; I don't think I know everything. I'll continue learning. So I was looking and learning from what he does and tried some things he did, and he tried some things I did, and I think the way our driving styles have evolved is probably a lot closer now. Now we're wanting similar things from the car, and it's getting better. I think that driving style difference was what hindered me the most at first, but it's all right now.Why aren't the HAT cars as consistently quick as the Triple Eight Commodores?As much as I don't want to pump up Triple Eight's tyres, with the cars that Ludo (Lucroix, technical director) has designed and evolved over the years since coming here (in late 2003); he's probably shown Australian motorsport that you can develop a car that can carry speed, can brake and turn in, you can carry the brake into the corner and flow a car through the corner.I think very much the mentality here previously was that you had to brake the thing as late as possible and then turn it really hard, and then get the car to squat really aggressively and drive off the corner. We've made a helluva lot of progress towards making ours cars move in the Triple Eight direction, and I expect we'll be a lot closer in 2012.You mentioned that initially you and Garth were wary of each other ...I don't think it was so much wary, as the fact that Garth had been at Clayton for six years already and it was very much his patch. He probably felt the same way Skaife did when Garth switched to HRT with the #1, but after working with me for a while, he probably realised that I'm not the idiot that I play [laughs]. I can bring things to the team and develop the car. I think we were wanting to earn each other's respect and that took a little while. I think we've surprised each other by how much we've opened up and how well we are getting on.I, for one, am pretty surprised. At the gala awards dinner, after I'd had a few drinks, I said to him "Garth, I thought you were an effing idiot last year, but you're actually a really top bloke!"So we actually have a great relationship. We have the same sense of humour, we joke about the same stuff, we watch all the same movies. So, yeah, I'm pretty surprised how well we've got on. I certainly didn't think we would've gotten on this well.Well, nobody else did, either. We were all predicting that you two were going to be at each other's throats.I think a characteristic in each other, that we both like, is that we just want to friggin' win. We don't care how we go about it, and Garth and I have a really good working relationship, but we're not bosom buddies.We don't call each other each day and just say "Howya doing, mate?" and that sort of stuff. It's not that sort of relationship. But we respect each other and work together, and I think that's something a lot o_fteammates, apart from Jamie and Craig, struggle with - that respect the two drivers have for each other. It's something that will make our combination a 1qtstronger once we do get this thing 100 per cent sorted.Clearly, the highlights of a difficult year were the second race at Abu Dhabi -a thrilling win, helped by strategy, but nevertheless you had to fight it out with Brighty - and the other was that second at Sandown.For me, the best result of the whole year was Sandown ahead of Abu Dhabi.It was crazy-arse conditions and we didn't get gifted that second place.We had to come through (from eighth on the grid) and pass everyone, and we did it on legitimate speed. But the biggest highlight was at Homebush, getting into 10th place in the championship after the year we've had. It was my goal after the enduros. I told the guys we had to do it and we did it. So those were the two highlights: getting up to 10th in the championship from where we were, and the second at Sandown in the wet. They meant more than the win at Abu Dhabi.So you made it your goal to get into the top 10 in the championship?We were sitting in 22nd or something at the time and the thing is, I knew all the work we'd been doing hadn't been reflected in the results. The thing I felt bad about was how hard my mechanics, Kyle and 'Spoon', worked. The amount of hours those guys worked and the changes they made over a weekend, keeping them there late at night. I kept saying to them "the car's getting better and better" and they probably thought I was an idiot because we hadn't won a race yet (since Abu Dhabi). So for us to come from where we were to make the 10 was a reward for all my guys' hard work. I think in the second half of the year, we were six1h in points. To get 10th was some compensation for the pretty tough couple of years the crew on that car (driven by Will Davison in his horr!Jr HRT season in 2010) had.But in the scheme of things, 10th is nothing to shout about. It's the worst ATCCN8 title defence on record.But it's better than what we were looking at. To get back into the 10 was what I was happy about, but, to be honest, I don't give a crap if was the best defence or the worst. It's not something that motivates me.Not embarrassing?If I'm worried about what people think, I would've been a crushed soul years ago. I think everyone realises by now that you can say what you want about me and it's not going to affect me. It's not like I value their opinion.Speaking of that - you ~tarred in the Auto Action Drivers' Poll again ...As always.But you didn't get the usual award for the most arrogant driver, which wasn't included this time ...What Garth and I couldn't believe is that he was voted the fairest driver. We thought that was pretty funny.Seriously, though, it must sting a little bit, especially the fans' voting you the biggest under-performer and also the worst driver. That can't make you happy.With the decision that I made to come over to Holden, I think 99 per cent of those people would've been angry Ford fans who were upset because I took the #1 to Holden and they've got nothing. I'm pretty sure it was driven by that.So you still don't care what the other drivers think of you?No. As long as the team that I'm working with is happy with me and my family's happy with me, that's what is important. But, to be honest, I don't lose any sleep over what the other drivers think. I don't value their opinions.Bizarrely, your best mate among the drivers is Russell lngall. How does that work?The one thing I respect him for, and why I probably get on with him the best of anyone, is that he's not superficial. He says it how it is. If he thinks you're a dick, he'll say it to you. You know, the guy really has achieved a lot.He was probably the first driver of our era - well, he's a bit older than me, as everyone knows [officially, 16 years older] - to go to Europe and to slog it out the way he did. He's quite a quiet achiever. I think he's done incredibly well for himself and, unlike a couple of others from his era, he doesn't go around telling everyone what they should and shouldn't be doing.He's kept his head down, done his job, won a championship. He's a nice guy, the old 'Muscle'.How's he going to do at Walkinshaw Racing? A lot of speculation about it being his last year, but do you think he's going to do better there?I think he will do better. I think he'll be happier here. Us drivers, we just want to be loved by our team and if you're not feeling the love from the team, then it's not going to work - and I don't think he was getting the love from his previous employer.When I was coming to HRT. I remember calling Fabs (Fabian Coulthard) and asking him "Hey, mate, what's it like? They just seem so unhappy, and not friendly". And he said "mate, as soon as you get on the inside, it's a boys' club and they are so tight" and it's so true. They couldn't do anything more for you and I think that's something that Russell will thrive on.Your move to HRT was pretty messy. Just when it looked like you were all set to go to FPR with (disaffected DJR co-owner) Charlie Schwerkolt, you defected to Holden. It's no wonder, then, that you alienated a lot of fans.[Long pause] Is that a question or a statement?A bit of both. The question is, do you understand why the Ford fans were so put out?Yes, but I think it'd be great if someone named Foges published the proper story of what really went on.They probably heard what FPR and Charlie wanted them to hear. I wasn't going to bad mouth anyone or shoot anyone down - it's not my style - so the Ford fans just heard one side of the story. Like everyone says, there are two sides to every story, and one day my side of the story will come out.But, in the end, I think I made the right decision and I'm 100 per cent happy with the one I made. Like I said earlier, I'd make the same decision again.A lot of people say you just went to HRT for the money (reportedly more than $1 million a year).Well, I could've got quite a bit more money to go the other way, so it wasn't about the money. My decision wasn't money-driven.In fact, your side of the story is coming out because we also have your manager Alan Gow robustly setting the record straight.Finally. I'll look forward to reading that.Ryan Walkinshaw has increasingly made his presence felt at HRT. He's unusual in the role, in that he's very young - even younger than you (23 vs 31) - and many would question whether he has enough experience to be at least semioverseeing such a big team.Look, I think people judge Ryan at face value, like they do with many things in this sport. They wouldn't know that the guy's doing night school to study engineering so he has more of an understanding of everything that's going on. He understands that he has a lot to learn, that's why the company has employed Steve Hallam and he had Mike (Henry) to guide him through the biggest part of last season.He's also had Ken Page, a longtime worker for his father in F1, and also the BTCC, guiding Ryan and overseeing the whole thing. You know, it hasn't been all of a sudden "Here you go, Ryan, you run the whole show and we'll see how you go". He's been coming out regularly and having a look at how it all works, and trying to get an understanding of the business. My hat goes off to him.I'm sure financially he doesn't have to do this, and I think it's been great that he's grabbed this opportunity and wants to represent the Walkinshaw family in the way that he has.I think his dad would be proud of him for being an important part of getting HRT back to the functioning setup that we have now. Like I said, he understands he has a lot of learning to do, but I think he's made a couple of really key good decisions that I think will pay off in the long run.You're convinced that HRT is going to get a lot better in 2012. Why?Well, because of the development we've done, the way Garth and I are working together, and the fact that the engineering group now has a very good grasp of what I'm wanting and what Garth's wanting from the car to get the speed out of it.I think the biggest single thing that's going to benefit us is to have someone of the calibre of Steve Hallam coming on board. Not only for us, but I think as a championship to be able to attract someone of his standing is showing where this championship has evolved to. For sure, Steve's not going to roll in and say "Hey, you need to do a turn of roll centre here and drop the ride height there". He's an engineer and it's all about processes and he's going to be putting things into place to get the most out of not only myself and Garth, but the engineering group as well.Also, he has the contacts worldwide to be able to help us develop our car. Just purely the knowledge that he has from all his years through F1 and NASCAR means he has a lot of experience and I think that's going to be a big benefit for us. I'm looking forward to start working with him, as our whole workforce is. There's quite a good buzz around Clayton now.Everyone can see that it's all turning around, that we're getting the speed. The driving group's very happy that we have a great leader who's about to come on board. There's no little cancer in there any more. All the cancer in the team has been cut out, and we're all willing to work hard and make the effort to get the team back on top.Of course, things are going to have to improve because if you guys aren't taking the fight right up to Triple Eight, serious questions will be asked, won't they?Oh, mate, they get asked every week when you don't beat them. For sure, Triple Eight have been the guys that are the benchmark and our job is to take that off them. It can be done. They have two arms and two legs like we have. And Whincup is definitely beatable.I did it in 2010 with his old equipment (ex-T8 FG Falcon), so they're not unbeatable, that's for sure.How hungry are you to take the fight up to Jamie again?There's nothing I want more than to wipe the smile off Jamie's face again. It's the motivation for our whole group. For someone to get up there and say they're got their #1 back again, I think it motivates the whole field.Not a big fan, eh?I respect him for what he's achieved. I think he's done a fantastic job, but I also think he's had a far superior machine than the majority of the field over the past few years, and I can't wait to get up there and stand on the top and look down on him.